Flip Flopping.....

[luvmetender]

Originally Posted by mayor

If Bush is such a flip-flopper, how come the dems aren't making any hay about it? Could it be they know nothing is there?

On another note, this does not bode well for Kerry...

Democrat Voter Participation Lowest Ever

WASHINGTON - Voter participation in the front-loaded Democratic primaries that helped turn John Kerry (news - web sites) into the party's presumptive nominee was among the lowest ever, according to a study released Tuesday.

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Kerry is already the democratic candidate. Who cares whether or not the turnout is high for the rest of the primaries. Doesn't matter. It's November that counts, and the democratic voter participation on that day, I predict, will be one of the highest in voting history.

And, my apologies to FUN, for responding to yet another hijack of his thread.

[whitequeen96]

Awright!!! Go, Fundamental, GO!

I, personally, don't have the time to argue this stuff. (My autistic kid needs me, as his special programs are being whittled down by Mr. "No Child Left Behind.") But I'm glad to see you take on some of the "overly self-confident" and "humility-challenged" posters here!

[mayor]

Originally Posted by luvmetender

Kerry is already the democratic candidate. Who cares whether or not the turnout is high for the rest of the primaries. Doesn't matter. It's November that counts, and the democratic voter participation on that day, I predict, will be one of the highest in voting history.

This was BEFORE he was the nominee. Super Tuesday primaries. Democrats are no more excited about John Kerry than Republicans were with Bob Dole. He's a non-candidate. He is "anybody but Bush".

But I have to agree with your prediction of record voting. There will be more DEAD registered democrats voting in this election than in previous elections. That and the down-trodden lower class that has been brainwashed to do exactly as their leadership tells them, even though they are the very people who keep them downtrodden. Interesting cycle, yes?

[Jwelch111]

This is a very good thread, which has been hijacked twice.

It would be interesting to re-watch the Gore / Bush debates to see how far astray Bush's aims and promises have gone. Re-watch Bush's Inaugural Address (which I taped: it immediately follows, on my tape, President Clinton's Farewell Address to the Nation). As I recall, Bush's Inaugural was rife with religious connotations, perhaps a foreshadowing of his Crusades? (MO!) But FUNdamental has listed one of his most crucial "flip-flops":

NATION-Building

From Iraq to non-intervention in the overthrow of Haiti's democratically elected President, Bush has meddled in other sovereign countries' business.

I think that Bush's finger was in the pie of Venezuela's troubles, too: the failed coup attempt is VERY suspicious. Condi Rice had a very strange comment at the time, which deprecated the democratic election of Chavez.

It's time to concentrate on OUR country: domestically, Bush is a disaster (MO).

[Taxman]

Let's get this thread back on track so that the peanut gallery can unrufle their feathers...

To answer the vast majority of Fundamentals claims, he’s wrong. The vast majority of what he had said is distortion and innuendo. It shows the same flawed reasoning that lead some on the right to go to great lengths to show Clinton as a murderer. It allows for no objective inspection of the facts. It’s nothing more than an attempt to muddy the waters.

[FUNdamental]

The list is laconic, but not at all wrong, and to compare it to emails sent around four plus years ago juxtaposing Clinton with murders is unfair.

Let me make lucid the point that was missed. Circumstances change, and people change their views. The President, running around listing the "flip flops" of John Kerry without presenting the circumstances surrounding the change, is displaying to me a disingenuous and intellectually absurd argument.

Let me give you an example. One year ago I didn’t want any American troops fighting in Iraq. However, now that we have done what we have done, I believe we should stay until we can train and trust a somewhat stable government. Am I "flip flopping" on my stance on American soldiers fighting in Iraq? No, because the circumstances changed.

Also changing your mind requires thinking. Not changing your mind requires no thinking. Get it?

[monkee]

Originally Posted by FUNdamental

The list is laconic, but not at all wrong, and to compare it to emails sent around four plus years ago juxtaposing Clinton with murders is unfair.

Let me make lucid the point that was missed. Circumstances change, and people change their views. The President, running around listing the "flip flops" of John Kerry without presenting the circumstances surrounding the change, is displaying to me a disingenuous and intellectually absurd argument.

Let me give you an example. One year ago I didn’t want any American troops fighting in Iraq. However, now that we have done what we have done, I believe we should stay until we can train and trust a somewhat stable government. Am I "flip flopping" on my stance on American soldiers fighting in Iraq? No, because the circumstances changed.

Also changing your mind requires thinking. Not changing your mind requires no thinking. Get it?

So, does your take on the issue of "flip-flopping" or whatever you want to call it, also extend to Republicans, or only Democrats? If so, then we should all take into account any changes in circumstances that occurred that caused any Republican to change his or her position on any matter. Which could, depending on how you look at it, invalidate your entire list in your OP, depending on how you interpret a "change in circumstances".

[FUNdamental]

My point was simple, but perhaps I will present it another way for you.

For the President to make "Flip Flopping" an issue is illogical, and ludicrous for the reasons I pointed out above. I simply listed some of the President’s own to demonstrate how many times he, who claims himself to be a strong, and “steady” (his own words) leader, has changed his views on issues.

It’s a non-issue that the president is trying to make a real issue, and, as clearly demonstrated to you, here, can bite the President in the butt if he’s not careful.

[FUNdamental]

Originally Posted by mayor

This was BEFORE he was the nominee. Super Tuesday primaries. Democrats are no more excited about John Kerry than Republicans were with Bob Dole. He's a non-candidate. He is "anybody but Bush".

But I have to agree with your prediction of record voting. There will be more DEAD registered democrats voting in this election than in previous elections. That and the down-trodden lower class that has been brainwashed to do exactly as their leadership tells them, even though they are the very people who keep them downtrodden. Interesting cycle, yes?

Since several Republican US Attorneys were fired recently for not seeing prosecutable and legitimate Democratic voter fraud in 2004, and they were all replaced by Republican [Rove] hacks, and since at the time you wrote this piece, according to former RNC and White House official Monica Goodling, the RNC had been up to their eyeballs in “caging,” which in reality is a felony and a voter suppression dirty trick, perhaps you should do a mea culpa for your insinuation that the Democrats would be involved in “voter fraud” in 2004.

Not an attack, I just thought it would be a nice thing for you to do with respect for all the current political nightmares for the Republicans and the White House.

[FUNdamental]

Originally Posted by mayor

But I have to agree with your prediction of record voting. There will be more DEAD registered democrats voting in this election than in previous elections. That and the down-trodden lower class that has been brainwashed to do exactly as their leadership tells them, even though they are the very people who keep them downtrodden. Interesting cycle, yes?

Being a religious person, I am reminded of the parable from the Bible, " And why do you look at the splinter in your brother's eye, and not notice the beam which is in your own eye?" Matthew 7:3

I am sure "Mayor" was not aware of the "caging" the RNC was putting forth at the time of his unfounded prediction, but for "Mayor" to blatantly assert Democrats would commit voter fraud was a disparaging red herring for the purposes of the damnation of his opposition party. This absurd assertion of “Mayor” was disingenuous at best, and an unethical statement under any circumstance.

Mayor, I hoped you have learned from your bad prescience, and you have been enlightened to quality life existence. Please tell us you have. I hope you see this post as a resource for encouragement to enlightenment and not an attack. I pray for your elucidation.