this is a loaded topic, but how are you guys feeling about religion these days?

[hannahsmom]

i am a parochial school alumna, and still consider myself catholic. off and on i'm in the choir. but now that we have a child (and the admittance lists for getting in private schools here are ridiculous because of some improving, but poor, academics in public school system), i find myself questioning my faith. not my faith in "god", although i don't picture her/him as a benevolent old man anymore. but my faith in some of the practices of the church - specifically the "no birth control" thing. (i understand no iuds, becuase i do believe humanity starts at conception. but why no pill? people don't need to have 15 kids to have 3 survive anymore. and the people who are following this rule are often in 3rd world countries and cannot afford any more mouths.) and the "no women in priesthood" thing. (the importance of jesus' coming to earth would be his HUMANITY, not his maleness.) and while the thought of abortions saddens me immensely, i do not feel like i have the right to make that decision for anyone else. i don't know. i feel increasingly intense about my spirituality and less about my catholicism. christianity on the whole is feeling more and more exclusionary to me. i do NOT feel like it's the only way, more like whatever way works for you, if it helps you be a better person, is great. is anybody else struggling w/ these kind of questions? paula.

[twonky]

I've always had a problem with ANY organized religion (Catholicism, Lutheran, SDA, etc...) They seem more grounded in their own doctrine rather than in the Bible.

I attend a non-denominational Bible church, everything we believe and practice, we pull straight from the Bible and not some man-made laws.

[hannahsmom]

twonky, do you not believe the bible is man made? oral tradition handed down over who knows how many years, then translated and re-translated (and re-translated) into languages that don't necessarily have the exact word in their vocabulary for that specific meaning? i personally believe the bible is a reference book, spiritually based, but no less imperfect than the rest of mankinds endeavors. (not to say AT ALL that if you belive verbatim, you're wrong. this is obviously a highly personal topic.) thanks for responding. paula.

[bradedit]

Paula,
I think every person who has grown in their faith have struggled with it at one time or another. Whatever religion or "non" religion that they practice.

[deal4u]

Hannahsmom, I would recommend reading the book Rome Sweet Home. A friend gave me this book about 6 years ago when I was going through the process of joining the Catholic Church. It shed some light for me and I found it to be very interesting and thought provoking.
My children attend Catholic school and I love it. I think being able to start the school day with a prayer is a great thing. The morals and values that aren't allowed in the public school are very important too.

[lectric]

hannahsmom
The Catholic church is not against the pill. The way my priest explained it.......Vatican II stated that the church will stand behind NFP..Natural Family Planning They approve of this method and suggest it to others. They do not state anything about the pill. In other words they are not against it they just do not suggest it.

[hannahsmom]

see, the perception i've had (encouraged by my parish priest, somebody who replaced an amazing person, fr. vernon robertson, and who doesn't hold a candle to that dear man) is that the church is AGAINST the pill. well, i guess there are incompetents in all fields. (sorry, but it's true.) thanks for the book rec deal4u, my bro-in-law converted when he and my sister married, and he probably knows more specifics about church than i do. (i'm an enfp - always more interested in big picture than details, and it certainly applies here, as well.) anyway, i'll pick it up. the only reading re religion i've done in some time is thomas merton. wonderful man. questioning man. i think questioning and examination are important in areas of faith. and i'm not getting the answers i want these days. but, yes, i loved catholic school. and contrary to what many believe, there was no "our way is the right way" where i attended. we studied all religions, and in depth.

[twonky]

Originally posted by hannahsmom
twonky, do you not believe the bible is man made? oral tradition handed down over who knows how many years, then translated and re-translated (and re-translated) into languages that don't necessarily have the exact word in their vocabulary for that specific meaning? i personally believe the bible is a reference book, spiritually based, but no less imperfect than the rest of mankinds endeavors. (not to say AT ALL that if you belive verbatim, you're wrong. this is obviously a highly personal topic.) thanks for responding. paula.

Or course there are some questions about translation, when those questions come up, I'll go back as far as I can understand.

However, I'm pretty sure some of the big translations (KJV, NIV, etc...) are reliable.

[twonky]

Originally posted by hannahsmom
and i'm not getting the answers i want these days.

I've said this before. Are you saying that you don't like the answers you're getting, or that you're not getting ANY answers? Where are you getting the answers from? From a person? Or your own research?

[tasker109]

hannahsmom, i left the catholic church over 20 years ago amid protests from my family. they didnt "go" to church but proclaimed catholicism. i had been studying the bible and went to a religion class at St Clares but they just didnt have the answers for me. There are many things they cant explain and I have since found out its because the catholic church kind of made up the rules as they went along. not to say they are bad people are have bad intentions. quite the contrary. but i need to know the truth. i couldnt send my kids to the school to study things that i didnt believe in and then perpetuate what i felt wasnt right. i am a non demoninational born again christian and must say, the freedom is unbelievable. i am bound by God's law, not the church's laws. this may sound weird, and i am dating myself, but during the second vatican council when the church decided it was ok to eat meat on friday except during lent, i was furious. what about all the people who died before confessing they had eaten meat on friday? what happened to them? first it was a sin and now its not? whats with that?? i thought, how dare they change laws?? then i found out that this was what happened all through the church's existence. they just made things up and all agreed to it. im sorry if it sounds like i am slamming the church, but for me, i couldnt continue being a catholic. it just wasnt right for me.

[sweetcindy]

Originally posted by tasker109
hannahsmom, i left the catholic church over 20 years ago amid protests from my family. they didnt "go" to church but proclaimed catholicism. i had been studying the bible and went to a religion class at St Clares but they just didnt have the answers for me. There are many things they cant explain and I have since found out its because the catholic church kind of made up the rules as they went along. not to say they are bad people are have bad intentions. quite the contrary. but i need to know the truth. i couldnt send my kids to the school to study things that i didnt believe in and then perpetuate what i felt wasnt right. i am a non demoninational born again christian and must say, the freedom is unbelievable. i am bound by God's law, not the church's laws. this may sound weird, and i am dating myself, but during the second vatican council when the church decided it was ok to eat meat on friday except during lent, i was furious. what about all the people who died before confessing they had eaten meat on friday? what happened to them? first it was a sing and now its not? whats with that?? i thought, how dare they change laws?? then i found out that this was what happened all through the church's existence. they just made things up and all agreed to it. im sorry if it sounds like i am slamming the church, but for me, i couldnt continue being a catholic. it just wasnt right for me.

Yes, I agree completely. I don't have much respect for any organized religion. I see it as some nice tidy box we try to fit God into...when it is us that should adapt to Him, not the other way around.
I think the line has definitely blurred between following a church doctrine and following God. Most often, they are not the same thing. So, for me, I would not go by what a church says the "law" is, I just go by what God says the Law is. Does that make any sense?
The RC Church particularly offends me when it says that the Pope is infalliable and has the same authority as God Himself. I never read that in my Bible so I can't buy that one.
I think the Catholics are sincere, loving people that are just seriously misled thru the legalities of the Vatican. I am hard pressed to put myself in a denomination...I just don't fit anywhere. I believe God, I believe the Bible is the inspired Word of God, and that is enough for me.

[miriama59]

I am against religion mainly because of the people that belong to them. FOr instance, Catholics in my family who felt that they could do anything, confess on Sunday, and go out to do it again.

Or some Adventists in my family who believe that it is ordained from the day you are born, what will happen to you. In Adventist school, I asked why try to be good then if it is ordained already? They weren't pleased with my attitude so I left early. It was summer classes so no loss to me.

Then there were the churches that gave prizes to my friends for how many people they got to come.

Or the one where I saw people rolling in the aisles speaking in tongues.

Get this straight, I have nothing against others and their religions. I am not sure what I believe. I do know that I am displeased with religions killing each other in the name of GOD, or looking down on others for the same reason. I hate it when people tell me that no matter what kind of life that I have led, it will be up to their ways of thought as to whether I have access to heaven. I was raised to question all and seek my answers where I can. I suppose I shall do this with God as well.

I believe in the woman's right to choose, women's right to be a priest, birth control, etc. Why shouldn't a woman have the right to take the pill? Why should a woman have children she doesn't want?


Great post. Thanks for the discussion.

[LocaChica]

wow, miriama! I was going to stay out of this thread until I could find a way to communicate my thoughts, but you took the words right out of my mouth.

[hmsram]

I have a couple things to say which I usually dont on releigion but I think this is really nice so I will say it.

I am catholic and on religion I feel that everyone has there own religion and no matter what that is I am fine with that. People are people and I dont care what religion it is . If its right for them then I am ok with it

There is no religion I have a problem with .
Ok maybe what I am saying makes no since in short.

All religion is ok with me
And all people are to...

I never debate on the topic just wanted everyone to know that I respect all the beleifs of everyone and you all have some very interesting things to say. As I do read all the topics on religion

Ok everyone have a wonderful evening I am finished babbling LOL

[cashhound]

Oh Boy! A good controversial topic. I LOVE these kinds of discussions. It gives me such a wonderful opportunity to learn from other people.

I am another one that has had issues with organized religion. I was raised Church of Christ. I still attend occasionally...mostly at my grandmother's request. It really bothers me to see these little old ladies who go to church everytime the doors are open...then they will trash another member. They are some of the worst gossips. And I do feel guilty for being there under false pretenses. When I do go, it is only to pacify my grandmother. It makes her feel better about my soul.

During grad school, we had to work on some translations. The prof chose the KJV. I simply can't agree with the translations we have now for the very reasons hannahsmom stated. The translations have slightly different meanings every time it went from one language to another.

Please don't get me wrong. I know many people to whom their faith is a vital part of their existance. I do respect them for that ability. But, at the same time, I would like for others to respect MY choices as well...even though they don't agree with most Christian's view of faith. And because I don't consider myself a Christian doesn't mean that I am a horrible person. I still try to live to be a good person.

I guess the best way to describe me is pagen. I have done quite a bit of research on the Native American culture. That philosophy (I hesitate to call it a religion) seems to ring true to me. I mean, the ones I have looked at. Geez, this doesn't seem to be making sense.

What it amounts to is that I have problems accepting the whole heaven/**** thing...again, for some of the same reasons hannahsmom stated. I'm not sure there is an omniscient Being, watching over us. I do believe in spirits/ghosts/souls...however you want to label them.

I do hope I haven't offended anyone with my thoughts. It wasn't my intention to imply that anyone else is wrong for their beliefs.

We all do what we have to to get along in the world. If religion/faith/God is your way, and it makes you a better person, and it gives you the answers you need...then great. It just doesn't work for me.