Ways to keep your marriage happy

[Pipanella]

You know why I can 'submit' to my husband? Because I know he is not going to require me to do anything beyond what God requires of me. I have no fear that he will ever lord himself over me in any way. And he never has. EVER. (Those of you who know me well, know this.)

If he ever required submission on my part, I know it would be something that I would need to take a look at within myself, to see if I were truly following God's principles, and if I wasn't, then I would submit to my husband's leading, because I would actually be submitting to God, under my husband's lead.

[Rockabillie]

I'm reading the posts, but it is IMPOSSIBLE to have submission without control. You can say God wants it til you're blue in the face, but if one person is submitting, the other is controlling because the definition of submission is to give control of one self to another. That's fact. The only point we're agruing is if that's sick, as I think, or if it's God's will, as others here think.

"It's for your own good." Yes, that is a line abusers use very often against the women they beat. It's a well-used justification for beating and controlling women, but it isn't true.

[Pipanella]

Originally Posted by Rockabillie

"It's for your own good." Yes, that is a line abusers use very often against the women they beat. It's a well-used justification for beating and controlling women, but it isn't true.

Well, I'll certainly agree with you there! And to make the jump from what the Bible says about marriage as justification for a man beating his wife isn't correct, either, no matter what the wife-beater says! To give that man credence by accepting a statement like that from him is a grave mistake.

[mayor]

Originally Posted by Pipanella

Why can't anyone understand that it's NOT about CONTROL? And the Bible does clearly state God's plan for marriage.

There are those that don't want to understand. They are far more comfortable with themselves when they can put people in boxes and label them according to their prejudice or bias. It's the way the world has always been. There is nothing new under the sun.

As for the Bible stating God's plan, recognize that the Bible also talks about "spiritual blindness". I once was blind. Now I see. But even that is an act of God, not of myself.

Mayor

[mayor]

In one way, Rock is right. Submission is about control, but not as stated.

What Rock is missing is that God is completely and entirely in control. We have none. Zip. Zilch. Nada. The puny decisions that we make from day to day are not control. Control is the ability to create a universe, speak a star into existence, breathe live into a human being or raise someone from the dead. THAT is control.

God wishes for us to recognize that HE is in control of our lives. That kind of submission is extremely difficult for us because our natural bent is to be stubbornly independent.

But, when we submit to His will and trust Him, we find that what He has for us is WAY better than what we think we can get on our own. Our pursuit of money, fame and power will never satisfy the deepest parts of our soul. Only God can meet the needs that He has put there specifically SO we would seek Him.

On a man/woman level, if a man is loving His wife as Christ loved the church (those who He came to die for), the question of "abusive" submission doesn't even come up. Remember, the MAN is to submit to his wife as well!

Just because people sin and take Bible verses out of context is a poor reason to not believe God. That's throwing the baby out with the bathwater if I ever saw it.

Mayor

[mayor]

Originally Posted by Reneek

It scares me when folks think that they KNOW what God's plan is. I think the worst thing that any couple can do is to let others TELL you that one has to be over the other. That's insanity....but if you want to believe that more power to you. Just don't presume to tell everyone else that your way is the 'RIGHT' way. I'll take equality any day, thank you very much! lol

Misunderstanding is what I see here.

And I'll let you read this for yourself...

Submit to one another out of reverence for Christ. Wives, submit to your husbands as to the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is the Savior. Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything.

Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her to make her holy, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word, and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless. In this same way, husbands ought to love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. After all, no one ever hated his own body, but he feeds and cares for it, just as Christ does the church-- for we are members of his body. "For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh." This is a profound mystery--but I am talking about Christ and the church. However, each one of you also must love his wife as he loves himself, and the wife must respect her husband. - Ephesians 5:21-33

Incidently, the woman has attempted to usurp this God-given role from men ever since the Garden of Eden.

To the woman he said,

"I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing;
with pain you will give birth to children.
Your desire will be for your husband,
and he will rule over you." - Genesis 2:16

Take a look at men today. They have been emasculated, allowing the feminist movement of the 60s and 70s to make them less "real men". Why do you think divorce is at an all-time high? Men are not taking up their true role as men. Why are there so many unwed mothers? Men don't know how to be men anymore.

Mayor

[bradedit]

Originally Posted by mayor

There are those that don't want to understand. They are far more comfortable with themselves when they can put people in boxes and label them according to their prejudice or bias. It's the way the world has always been. There is nothing new under the sun.



Mayor

Sorta like this box!(Just to clarify, mayors words, not mine) if people would only practice what they preach!

Liberals usually aren't funny unless they are being crude, crass, or disrespectful. That stopped working on me by the time I turned 18.

3 I used to be a liberal and was persuaded to the conservative point of view through logic and life experiences. However, for the most part, the democratic base is uneducated and far more likely to listen to hip hop music than talk radio

[mayor]

When we speak of "boxes", we are talking of a majority, not necessarily individuals. For example, Gore received 50% of the popular vote, plus a few. So it is said that the American people voted for Al Gore, when the truth is that almost that many did NOT vote for him.

Regarding my statements, I stand by them in the same vein. Liberals aren't funny when they are politicizing their liberalism. And the democratic base (lower socio-economic) has a major education problem and IS far more likely to listen to hip hop music than talk radio. Check the demographics and you will find this to be true. It doesn't mean that every now and then you'll find a funny liberal, or that ALL democrats are uneducated, eminim-loving folk. It just means a significant number fit the description.

It is a totally different thing in the case of this discussion with Rock. Myself and others are saying that submission is wrong when it comes to abuse, but Rock insists on saying that submission is wrong BECAUSE some will abuse it.

What we are saying is not being heard. There is no excuse for this except that Rock does not want to hear what we are saying.

Mayor

[freesurfer]

In submitting you have to be clear on what it is about though when talking control with it. Submitting sexually is different than submitting because I am female.

HOLY SMOKES BATMAN!!! I agree 100% with Mayor on this:

Take a look at men today. They have been emasculated, allowing the feminist movement of the 60s and 70s to make them less "real men". Why do you think divorce is at an all-time high? Men are not taking up their true role as men. Why are there so many unwed mothers? Men don't know how to be men anymore.

[kat]

Hmmm.. Mayor - do you think that men are emasculated when they concede that their wife is simply the better choice to do the "manly" chores and they're better at doing the traditional "wifely" duties?

If so, then I suppose you'd have a real problem here. I'm the one who does the plumbing, house painting, etc. and my husband is the housecleaner. Now, I try to avoid his cooking & clothes washing because I am better at those jobs But, for the most part, there are no chores that go by gender in my house - we simply divide things by who is the one that does it better

My husband knows how to "be a man" and so do both of our sons. Our daughter is well aware of how to "be a woman". Maybe this comes from having parents who were forward thinking and never allowed my sister or I feel that we couldn't do things just because we are females (although, we were told more than once that we were NOT allowed to do things at school/in society just for that reason). I always find it interesting that those who think that feminists are wrong are generally too young to have a clue as to what it was like! Maybe if you had to live with people telling you no because of your gender, then you would understand why it would be reprehensible to take away those freedoms that were won by the feminist movement!

[Pipanella]

Mayor can answer for himself, but I'll tell you what I feel about that issue. The Bible tells me that when a man and a woman get married, the two become one. To me, that means we operate as a team. In order to do that, we each do what we are best at. We complement each other. No gender differentiating at our house, when it comes to doing chores!

Of course, of the two of us, I DID have to be the one to give birth, and yes, that was a chore!! LOL!!

[bradedit]

I was lucky growing up my parents worked as a team and they have been married for 55 years are happy, they worked as a team to get things done so they could spend more time with us! DH and I work that way too, I LOVE to work in the yard, cutting grass, fertilizing,edging, etc. Goodness my DH is a nurse practioner, the kids go running to daddy when they have a boo-boo, why because it is practical.

Luckily DH doesn't have act like a Neanderthal to be a real man.

[Pipanella]

Originally Posted by bradedit

I was lucky growing up my parents worked as a team and they have been married for 55 years are happy, they worked as a team to get things done so they could spend more time with us! DH and I work that way too, I LOVE to work in the yard, cutting grass, fertilizing,edging, etc. Goodness my DH is a nurse practioner, the kids go running to daddy when they have a boo-boo, why because it is practical.

Luckily DH doesn't have act like a Neanderthal to be a real man.

Same here, Tami. I had a very good example growing up, in fact, I thought my parents' marriage was just about perfect. Mom worked full-time (beautician, had her own shop at our house), Dad had the neighborhood grocery store, I saw just enough smoochin' and 'discussing' to be healthy, and there was never ever a doubt in my mind that each of my parents loved the other with all their heart. Now, as an adult, I know the marriage wasn't perfect then, nor is it now, but I still think after 52 years, it's about as good as it gets.

My Dad has never acted like a Neanderthal, as Tami put it , nor does my DH. And both my dad and my DH are anything but emasculated.

Guess I should feel darn lucky to have the life I do. I not only feel lucky, I feel blessed.

[mayor]

I am definitely not talking about what chores men and women do about the house. Nor am I speaking of "neanderthal" men. I have no problem with my wife mowing the lawn, hammering a nail or handling a drill, if she is moved to do so.

Feminism brought about some good changes, no doubt. It also wreaked some incredibly negative consequences on our society. We are experiencing the fallout now.

Mayor